Dany, they are all gutless pussies.  You gotta give it to the Turks, some may perceive them to be dumb as rocks, but they've got balls.  Again, they brought the world's supposed superpower to its knees.  Not only did they get us to back down on the Genocide resolution, but they passed their own resolution to invade Northern Iraq against all protests from our administration.  We politely ask the Turks not to make our lives harder in Iraq by invading it, and they tell us to f--- off.  They threaten that they will make our lives harder in Iraq unless we withdraw a nonbinding humanitarian resolution that is 92 years overdue, and we withdraw it, and they still go ahead and make our lives harder in Iraq anyway.  How come the President isn't on CNN and CNBC and FOX and every other neocon channel berating the Turks for risking our soldiers' lives now?  What happened to the soldiers the President was so worried about? 

What happened to our country!  I guess you get the government you deserve, but I don't think the American people deserve a government that would not only portray us as warmongering imperialists but would humiliate us in full view of the whole world!

No need to blame Turkey. I take the opposite view: Armenian-American ANCA wants to legislate history and prevent any honest and full discussion of the painful subject. ANCA simply doesn't care if U.S. interest are at stake. Couple of interesting articles in National Review by Barbara Lerner provide a good background

http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=OTAxNThjN2UyZjExNmRhOTY1OTU3OTNiMzEzNDJjY2Y=

http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=MDI2ZmMwMjJhNjMxZGNmZGVjOTc5MmQwMDY5OWY0ZmY=

The following "Armenian Revolt" documentary provides, a rather fair, in my opinion, review of the subject by a number of leading historians on the subject

This is the same Steve Cohen that introduced the slavery apology in the second month of his freshman year in Congress and was a vocal proponent of anti-hate legislation. He fails to see the inconsistency between genocide denial and his apology for slavery/Jim Crow. He vigorously recruited the U.S.-Turkey study group to come to Memphis and helped Turkey to be selected as the 2008 Memphis in May festival honoree. One media blog that is fairly influential in Memphis implied that Cohen didn't think his constituency would be sophisticated enough to pick up on the discordance among his political views. Panic set in for Cohen when he realized that the jig was up, that his sensitive persona was soon to be exposed as f.o.s., as a ploy to gain favor of his largely African-American constituents. That's when the press conferences started as did his reinvention as a neocon hawk.

One local blogger compared him to Leonard Zelig, capable of transforming his appearance into that of whoever is around him.

Of note, and illustrative of the milieu in Memphis, is that the local paper won't mention Turkey without the preface of "close ally". Cohen underestimated the opposition to his shenanigans, thinking Memphians were either 1. apathetic/ignorant or 2. so blindly Bush-friendly that they would oppose anything so un-American as denying the first genocide of the 20th century, lest it should somehow harm our troops. He was wrong on both.

“… It is doubtful that we shall witness in the near future a plethora
of instances of outright denial. But subtle, and
consequently more dangerous, theories continue to appear. The course of
this development and the nature of the theories, however
pseudo-scientific they may be, must be fully examined.

We need
not waste time or effort answering each and every one of the deniers'
contentions. It would be a never-ending effort to respond to arguments
posed by those who freely falsify findings, quote out of context and
simply dismiss reams of testimony because it counters their arguments.
Unlike true scholars they have little if any respect for data or
evidence. Their commitment is to an ideology and their 'findings' are
shaped by it.

However, there is a critical difference between
debate and analysis. To debate them is to give their theory the
imprimatur of a legitimate historical opinion. It is far better to
analyze who these people are and what it is they are trying to
accomplish. Above all, it is essential to expose the illusion of
reasoned inquiry that conceals extremist views. It is only when society
- particularly that portion of society committed to intellectual debate
-comprehends the full import of this group's intentions that we can be
sure that history will not be reshaped and recreated to fit a variety
of pernicious ulterior motives.

The
speciousness of the deniers' arguments, rather than the arguments
themselves, demands a response. The insidious way in which denial
enters the mainstream debate - often disguised as relativism- must be
fully exposed as it is crucial, ultimately, to an understanding of the
deniers' influence. These are not simply arcane controversies between
scholars or, in this case, pseudo-scholars. In the words of the
historian Donald Kagan,
the past and, more importantly, our perception of the past, have a
powerful 'influence on the way we act in response to our problems
today. What historians and others say happened and what they say it
means. . .makes a great difference'. Relativists and deniers are well
aware of this. It is not by chance that one of the fathers of American
Holocaust denial, Harry Elmer Barnes, believed that history could serve
as a 'means for a deliberate and conscious instrument of social
transformation'.

History
matters. Adolf Hitler's rise to power was facilitated by the artful way
in which he advanced views of recent German history that appealed to
the masses. It did not matter if it was a distorted view; it was one
which appealed to many people and, more importantly, explained their
current situation. David Duke has tried to modify his personal history
as well as the history of the United States and his region. That which
he has been unable to reshape, he and his followers have declared
irrelevant. On the eve of the election for Governor of Louisiana, one
of his supporters remarked in a television interview: 'What do his
views on Jews and Blacks have to do with this election?' Though the
interviewer did not respond, the answer was obvious: it was, simply
put, 'everything'.

The
deniers hope to achieve their goals by winning recognition as a
legitimate scholarly cadre and by planting seeds of doubt in the
younger generation. Only by recognizing the threat that denial poses to
reason and the pursuit of truth, will we expose denial for what it
truly is and ultimately refuse any shred of legitimacy to it and its
purveyors.”

Deborah Lipstadt
HOLOCAUST DENIAL AND THE COMPELLING FORCE OF REASON

Turkey's fear-mongering theatrics are working: US Representatives are indicating that they may be voting their fears instead of their values.

Or do I smell a backlash around the corner? what? Turkey using blackmail? threatening our servicemen?

Shame on Turkey for blackmailing us, and shame on our representatives for betraying our values!

You can read the article denouncing Cohen's hypocrisy here:

http://www.commercialappeal.com/news/2007/oct/14/cohens-turkey-stance-a-puzzler/

Does anyone have a list of the congressmen who have withdrawn under pressure their co-sponsorship of H. Res. 106?  I think these flip-flooppers need to be exposed for the gutless cowards that they are.

Yup. You can find all the details regarding the bill on the library of congress website.

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d110:HE00106:@@@P

I copy-pasted the full list below

Rep Berry, Marion [AR-1]
- 1/31/2007(withdrawn - 10/15/2007)

Rep Kilpatrick, Carolyn C. [MI-13]
- 1/31/2007(withdrawn - 10/15/2007)

Rep English, Phil [PA-3]
- 1/31/2007(withdrawn - 3/15/2007)

Rep Jindal, Bobby [LA-1]
- 1/31/2007(withdrawn - 1/31/2007)

Rep Holden, Tim [PA-17]
- 1/31/2007(withdrawn - 10/16/2007)

Rep Bishop, Sanford D., Jr. [GA-2]
- 1/31/2007(withdrawn - 10/15/2007)

Rep Carnahan, Russ [MO-3]
- 1/31/2007(withdrawn - 10/2/2007)

Rep Shimkus, John [IL-19]
- 1/31/2007(withdrawn - 10/4/2007)

Rep Boren, Dan [OK-2]
- 1/31/2007(withdrawn - 5/2/2007)

Rep Davis, Lincoln [TN-4]
- 1/31/2007(withdrawn - 10/15/2007)

Rep Moore, Dennis [KS-3]
- 1/31/2007(withdrawn - 3/13/2007)

Rep Ross, Mike [AR-4]
- 1/31/2007(withdrawn - 10/15/2007)

Rep Scott, David [GA-13]
- 1/31/2007(withdrawn - 4/18/2007)

Rep Johnson, Henry C. "Hank," Jr. [GA-4]
- 2/8/2007(withdrawn - 10/16/2007)

Rep Lamborn, Doug [CO-5]
- 2/8/2007(withdrawn - 10/16/2007)

Rep Tancredo, Thomas G. [CO-6]
- 4/19/2007(withdrawn - 6/27/2007)

Rep Kuhl, John R. "Randy", Jr. [NY-29]
- 6/20/2007(withdrawn - 10/18/2007)

Rep Mitchell, Harry E. [AZ-5]
- 6/21/2007(withdrawn - 10/16/2007)

Rep Cuellar, Henry [TX-28]
- 6/26/2007(withdrawn - 10/9/2007)

Rep Wicker, Roger F. [MS-1]
- 6/26/2007(withdrawn - 6/28/2007)

Rep Boyd, Allen [FL-2]
- 6/28/2007(withdrawn - 10/15/2007)

Rep Cummings, Elijah E. [MD-7]
- 6/28/2007(withdrawn - 10/18/2007)

Rep Larsen, Rick [WA-2]
- 6/28/2007(withdrawn - 10/17/2007)

Rep Herger, Wally [CA-2]
- 7/18/2007(withdrawn - 10/15/2007)

Thanks for the list.  Time for calls and letters!

The flood waters have subsided, and Noach, his three sons, and their wives all emerge from the ark. A new dawn awaits mankind. Noach's first response is to build an altar and make an offering to G-d. G-d responds positively. Man and G-d are back on track. Yet within generations things again have gone awry: Man's ego has once again gotten the best of him.

The generation of the flood had neither time nor a place for G-d, and did all in their power to simply boot Him from this world. The generation of the Tower of Bavel (Babylon), also known as the generation of the dispersion, had a better idea: 'Rather than make a place on this earth for G-d, let's make a place for us in heaven. In other words, we don't want a G-dless world, we want G-d very much. Only we want to be G-d!'

To achieve this end, they formed together a single society, with a single language, and a single ethos. Their morality was a morality of convenience and expedience. Their commandments were man-made commandments, produced for the gratification of the moment and disposable. They were not eternal truths revealed to an entire nation. There was no covenant agreed to by Giver and receiver. Their law was the law of the elite, take it or leave it. It's intended purpose was not for the good of the individual, or the family, or even the community. Its purpose was to promote the "plan." The "plan," of course, was the tower, whose top was to pierce the heavens, and conquer forever the exalted heights from which the rulers could look down at all they had accomplished. Therefore, our sages teach us, if a brick were to fall from the construction site and plummet earthward, work would be stopped and mourning would begin. That is how important the material was. However, if a worker slipped and plunged to his death, the surviving workers worked on. That's how utterly unimportant human life was.

Sound familiar? We live in a world today in which the technology of communication is so advanced that we all, in effect, speak the same language. And once again today, there are those self-proclaimed Nimrods who are using this common tongue to impose upon the rest of us their politically correct morality, for the sole purpose of "building the tower," supplanting G-d in the world, and replacing His law with theirs. Today the tower is called "the peace process." The bricks in this process consist of destroying the remnants of the Holy Temple and wresting the Temple Mount from G-d by handing it over to bloodthirsty terrorists; of uprooting hundreds of thousands of G-d fearing Jews from their homes in biblical Judea and Samaria, and handing the land of the patriarchs over to bloodthirsty terrorists; and of terrorizing the Jews in the remaining land of Israel into spiritual and physical defeat and exile. And for what purpose? So that someone, anyone, can sit at the top looking down. Someone, anyone, but G-d.

What can be done? The situation seems to have spun out of control. It's overwhelming. The Torah reading of Noach concludes with the birth and early history of Avraham avinu - our patriarch Abraham. As we will learn in this coming Shabbat Torah reading of Lech L'cha, Avraham, the young idol-smasher, with some clear thinking and intrepid action, was able to extricate himself from the politically correct prison into which he was born, and create a new society in which G-d, and not man, is the sole source of truth and morality. This very same Torah based society is taking deep root today in the land of Israel and cannot be shaken by all the Nimrods the world over. Their towers will fall, and we will still be standing.

The "Marmara" daily, one of two Armenian-language dailies in Istanbul, on his Oct. 19 issue has picked up the following piece from the Turkish daily "Hurriyet" (my translation), one of the most popular in Turkey:

China
threatens that our relationship with them will be “gravely undermined" if
we honor the Dalai Lama, Turkey
warns that “longtime ties will be harmed” if we acknowledge the Armenian genocide…

Damn! How do they (Turkey
and China)
think they can get away with this?

Do they believe we are so weak, that our economy is so shaky,
our alliances so dwindled, our forces stretched so thin, that they can bully us
on mere issues of principle?

I guess so.

The image of the STRONG AMERICA is dead in the eyes of the
world.

This "US-Isra-Turkic" triumvirate have their heads so far up each others ass that they don't seem to see anything else around them anymore. If an issue does not fit their "cranio-rectally inverted" realpolitik agenda, than that too would have as much chance of success as piss on a forest fire.

The governing heads of the above mentioned trio have a delusional view of the world. It is time to pull their heads out of each others butts and smell the roses for a change -There are other groups and countries too you know; other issues and concerns of mankind; other ways of solving problems - This dangerous policy, if ignored much longer will come back to haunt us in the future. We can not afford to let these two countries manhandle the US as if we were some little mailable "Pillsbury doughboys".

Here is a link for anyone who sill has a shred of doubt about the events of 1915:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GOqnVl4_rWU

 Raphael Lemkin, the Polish-Jewish legal scholar who coined the word "genocide", invented the concept partly on the basis of the extermination of the Armenians in 1915.  Lemkin, who lost 49 members of his family during the Holocaust, said the following in an 1949 interview with CBS on the UN Convention on Genocide:  "I became interested in genocide because it happened to the Armenians; and after[wards] the Armenians got a very rough deal at the Versailles Conference because their criminals were guilty of genocide and were not punished."

I mean, self-deception has its limits. Next thing we know they won't let us roast turkey on Thanksgiving Day.

 The veracity of the Armenian genocide is not a matter of debate; it is settled history. What's in flux is the process of introspection by many Turks to re-learn their own history. Hopefully this process will one day lead to recognition of the genocide by the Turkish state. 

Jewcy seems to be an inappropriate name for this website.

It truly shocks the conscience to hear the ferocious effort that Israel and its corresponding U.S. lobby are putting into Genocide Denial.  Everyone says Jews are smart.  And perhaps they are smart on the details.  But it appears that on the large subjects, they do not learn.  Israel was born out of a Holocaust.  What will it take for Israelis to denounce Genocide?  What more of a lesson do you need than to be descended from a people who were almost whiped off the face of an entire continent?  How can Genocide Denial be in the best interest of a people and a country that have been perspecuted, massacres, and exterminated over and over and over for time immemorial?  Do the Jews feel themselves that powerful now that they really don't believe it can ever happen to them again? 

And what adds to the shock value for me is that there is a direct and inescapable link between the Armenian Genocide and the Holocaust.  The same German military machine was in Turkey and watched with silent approval as the Turks carried out their plan.  They saw and they learned.  Many of these people later became military leaders in the SS.  They knew it could be done without consequence, because it had been done just 20 years before to the Armenians and nobody cared.  And today Israel and unfortunately many American Jewish leaders are lobbying against Genocide recognition knowing full well the link between the Armenian Genocide and the Holocaust. 

I have heard nothing that AIPAC is doing anything regarding the Armenian genocide denial.  If you have specific information then you should share it with us, otherwise I'm not quite sure what you are talking about.

I don't know what AIPAC has been up to for the past few months, but they have always lobbied against all past attempts at an Armenian Genocide resolution, and I haven't heard anything to the contrary on this latest resolution.  Thus, I can only assume that they have not changed their position.  The other major organizations, however, still oppose it.  See the article below.

http://www.forward.com/articles/11847/

P.S. Anon 4:04 was me, Phantom.

Cohen is the 24-year veteran of a Tennessee state
Senate seat in a racially mixed district who likens his voting record
to that of "a black woman." He attempted to become the first white on the Congressional Black Caucus.

This peculiar individual has used the social issues of his constituency to his ascent to power. Cohen said. "Hate crimes are a way of saying that you better not get
out of line or you'll end up in the bottom of the river. We've got to
stand up to that."

Apparently he doesn't view hate crimes and genocide in a similar manner. He is now aggressively campaigning against the Armenian Genocide bill. He has vigorously recruited the U.S.-Turkey study group to come to Memphis, and admitted that his opposition to the recognition of the Armenian genocide had something to do with his hosting of this group. Anti-hate and soft on genocide. Sick stuff.

There you go agin you filthy turks No need to blame Turkey???

Honest and full
discussion of the painful subject foiryou tuks?!?!

 you WOULDN'T know what honest is if it hit you in your skull.

JUST like you don't know what discassion is all about. Discussion is NOT about killing as tortuining the innocent. Y

OU STILL HAVN'T LEFT YOU MONGOLIAN BEHAVIOUR WHILR YOU TRY TO PORTYAY YOURSELF AS CIVILIZED. YOU ARE ANYTHING BUT CIVILIZED.  YOU ARE CRIMINALS. PERIO,

ANCA simply doesn't care if U.S.
interest are at stake. Couple of interesting articles in National
Review by Barbara Lerner provide a good background

Foxman Assures Gul that Genocide Bill is not Relevant

ISTANBUL (Marmara)--During his visit to the United States, Turkish President Abdullah Gul met Thursday with representatives of Jewish organizations, among them the Anti-Defamation League, who assured the Turkish leader that the Armenian Genocide resolution pending in Congress should not worry his government or the Turkish people.

During a meeting with ADL national chairman Abraham Foxman, Gul was assured of the organization's opposition to the Genocide Resolution, adding that the matter was no longer a relevant concern for Jewish organizations, which will continue to oppose the measure.

Foxman said that his organization was pleased that Turkey had friendly relations with the US, Israel and the Jewish-American community.

After his meeting with Gul, Foxman told reporters that the Armenian Genocide Resolution had ceased to be an issue, since it was not the Congressional agenda. After reiterating his organization's opposition, he added that utilizing the Armenian Genocide issue for political gain was wrong. He also urged for the creation of a council of historians to assess the events of 1915.

Friday, January 11, 2008

http://www.asbarez.com/