I am pretty sure that most Armenian activists will not be satisfied, and perhaps various Jews as well, but I'm trying to decide if this step goes far enough to make this issue go away or not. Recognizing something but not wanting politicians to get involved might be seen as understandable by some, or at least enough to not warrant ending the No Place for Hate program elsewhere and therefore effectively end the controversy.
That said, Tarsy was fired for recognizing the genocide- and now that the organization recognizes it too (though which blatantly arm-twisting quite apparent in the statement) what does that mean? I have a feeling Foxman is not going to be welcoming Tarsy back, which just seems ridiculously unfair.
I wonder if this move will take the wind out of the sails of this movement or it will still continue? I mean merely saying we recognize it as genocide but not doing a thing about it and continuing on as always is hardly satisfactory. Show us that you mean it Foxman. It's a bit difficult to continue to criticize the ADL post-recognition though.
I'm still trying to figure out this whole thing.

I find it quite easy to continue criticizing the ADL for their position, because through Foxman, they are still lobbying against Congressional recognition of the Genocide. This statement Foxman has made is essentially sending a message to Congress that the ADL does not support Congressional recognition even though they begrudgingly admit that it was a Genocide. I don't know what other Armenian-Americans think about this, but I don't find it acceptable. I know of no Armenian organizations that would ever lobby against Congressional or any other type of recognition and commemoration of the Holocaust.

Phantom, are you certain that the ADL is still lobbying against the bill that Jewish senator Adam Schiff introduced to have the U.S. officially recognise the Armenian genocide? I had thought this acknowledged the reversal of their stance.

True, Foxman seems to want it both ways. He's being contradictory and clearly not genuine, merely saying what needs to be said in hopes of the issue going away.

I just hope this new turn of events doesn't successfully water down the issue enough for it to go away. It's already suffered from a shameful under-reporting throughout the country except for Massachusetts. For it to be a Boston Globe front page issue, and not even catch a line in any other paper anywhere in the country is pretty shameful. This is not a local issue, it's a national issue and should be reported as such. Armenian groups will need the resolve of their many supporters in Jewish and municipal organizations in order to keep the momentum going, because I'm hoping that people don't look at this and say "ok, they got the statement of recognition they wanted, time to pack up and go home."

The ADL's new statement says they still oppose any genocide resolutions:

"Having said that [recognition of the Armenian Genocide], we continue to firmly believe that a Congressional resolution on such matters is a counterproductive diversion and will not foster reconciliation between Turks and Armenians and may put at risk the Turkish Jewish community and the important multilateral relationship between Turkey, Israel and the United States."

Anonymous,

The letter itself is clear form of lobbying against Congressional recognition. It says quite openly that the ADL opposes passage of the Armenian Genocide Resolution. I don't know how much clearer Foxman could have made himself.

Also, I'd like to discuss this whole matter of putting at risk the Turkish Jewish community. Why does the ADL keep saying that? What does this resolution have to do with the Turkish Jewish community? Are present day Turks so maniacal that they are going to harm Turkish Jews because Armenian groups in the U.S. managed to get the Genocide Resolution passed after trying for 30 years? Moreover, why can't U.S. Jewish groups simply tell the Turks that they will support them on any other issue, but on this issue they wish to remain silent completely silent and not support either group. Why would that have lead to any risk for the Turkish Jewish community?

I was going to comment on the same thing- this whole "Turkish Jews are in danger" if the US recognizes the genocide is absurd. What kind of a weasely excuse is that- that the Jews of Turkey might be attacked by enraged Turks because their lobby in America didn't do everything in their power to keep it from being recognized?
We know that Turkish FM Gul has had meetings earlier in the year (and I'm sure in the past) with the leaders of a couple Jewish organizations, most notably Foxman. Does this imply that the Turkish FM actually made threats against the Jewish community in his country if the ADL wasn't complicit in denial? Are they really being blackmailed with Jewish lives?
Unlikely. That's just too low to contemplate. I do think it's just an excuse which serves Foxman's wider goals, though I wonder what we and Turkey are to make of Foxman's continued insinuations of having to lie and fight against the truth in exchange for the Turkish government guaranteeing the safety of Jews there?

Phantom says "I'd like to discuss this whole matter of putting at risk the Turkish Jewish community."

Me, too. As I suggested (perhaps not explicitly enough) in the Fire Foxman article, I don't believe the ADL and the other Jewish orgs were protecting Turkish Jews, I think they were exploiting them by passing on their letter to advance a policy goal. I haven't seen anyone else touch on that, until the other day Andrew Bostom memorably wrote:

"[T]he ADL abets the exploitation of beleaguered Turkish Jews as dhmmi “lobbyists” for the government of Turkey."

I'm going to try to elaborate on the issue in a coming blog post.

Well, I don't see anyone from Turkey denying that the Turkish government or some other Turkish group made such threats. So, I guess it's entirely possible, although not likely. But even if it is true, what I can't fathom is why any Jewish group would let themselves be pushed around like that. Who the hell is Turkey to threaten Jews or Israel? Israel can erase Turkey from the face of this Earth if it wants to! Turkey should be sucking Israel's arse, not the other way around!

Re: "The letter itself is clear form of lobbying against Congressional recognition. It says quite openly that the ADL opposes passage of the Armenian Genocide Resolution. I don't know how much clearer Foxman could have made himself."

(1) Foxman could have kept his nose, and ADL's, out of this mess in the first place.

(2) I will not believe anything Foxman says until he reinstates Andrew Tarsy with back pay and an apology, apologizes to the Armenian community, and withdraws ADL's opposition to the Congressional resolution.

(3) Stormfront.org is now using ADL's actions to broad-brush all Jews as no better than Holocaust deniers. We need to make it clear that Abraham Foxman is no more representative of Jews than David Duke and Tom Metzger are of white Gentiles, or Al Sharpton is of Black people.

My perception is that Foxman is a political pimp who sells the ADL's prestige, credibility, and good name the way a real pimp sells a woman's virtue. It is past time that that was made clear to ADL's donors (the organization rakes in more than $50 million a year) so they can find better uses for their money.

Joey, does anyone have Andrew Tarsy's contact information? There is some information I would like to send him.

No Phantom, "Israel cannot erase Turkey from the face of the map if wants to". Thats an ridiculously ignorant statement and perhaps the reverse is closer to the truth. albeit an unlikely scenario.

I don't quite understand what Foxman is doing in any case. I personally think he must have had a stroke or something to say the things he is saying. I don't think there are too many Jews who are not sympathetic with Armenians on this.

I really hope he gets kicked out on his petard over this, because he clearly has NOT apologized and is playing games with his remarks.

Bill, no, haven't got it. Looking for that myself.

Has anyone noticed the American Jewish Committee press release today (open letter from David Harris)? Kudos to Harris for his honest appraisal of the tension between the right and the real.

The ADL hasn't been the only Jewish organization with problematic positions on the issue - AJC and B'nai Brith International also forwarded the letter from the Turkish Jewish community opposing the Congressional resolution. But now the AJC, which works not only with the Turkish Jewish community but also with the Armenian Jewish community (yes, there is one), has quite openly and honestly revisited its policies. I suspect that the AJC's policy shift, more than anything else, forced the ADL's hand.

He's still a pos.

Anonymous, you're right. I was overzealous with my sentiment there. And I certainly wasn't advocating a fight, but simply trying to express my confusion as to why Jews or Israel would tolerate such overt threats by a government, if such threats were actually made, as Foxman keeps telling us.

Being an Armenian-American (3rd generation), I find the ADL's position sad at best.

I have several questions for your Jewish Armeican readership.

1) Why has your community has trivialized the genocide of the Armenians thinking it would take away the uniqueness of the tragety we call the Holocaust?

Every act of genocide is unique in its own way and each act takes away a unique cultural heritage that is the inheritance for all of mankind. All are equally non-trivial.

2) How can you let your leadership become involved with working against the U.S. Congress recognition in a formal manner the genocide of the Armenians?

Your absolute leader, Abraham H. Foxman, still states "we continue to firmly believe that a Congressional resolution on such matters is a counterproductive diversion and will not foster reconciliation between Turks and Armenians and may put at risk the Turkish Jewish community and the important multilateral relationship between Turkey, Israel and the United States."

Who is this Jewish-American man who should pass judgement and his opinion on how my Congress should or should not give rememberance to a (my ancestral) culture and people destroyed by genocide?

What makes him an expert in determining how reconciliation between Turks and Armenians can be accomplished?

If he was truly concerned about the reproachment and reconciliation between the Turks and Armenians - then he would advocate the opening of the Turkish-Armenian border by the Turks without any preconditions. Of coarse he is not advocating reproachment and reconciliation between Armenians and Turks and this is stated in his last sentence - "may put at risk the ... important multilateral relationship between Turkey, Israel and the United States" - which is the trump card he uses to justify why the Jewish American commumity (as always) does not support this congressional resolution.

3) Please explain to me because I do not understand how Turkish Jews are at risk from this U.S Congressional resolution?

If this man was truly sencere he would have would have stated Turkish Armenians are at risk instead of Turkish Jews. No one believe Turkish Jews are at risk if this resolution passes - Turkish Armenians - well there is the possibility. Also if anything did happen to either of the two minorities, if this resolution is passed, then what would that say about the Turks and their nation. The true point is that he states that "Turkish Jews are at rish" to fan the flames of fear within the Jewish community. How come no one mentions how the Turks treated the Jews during WWII? How short is your memory or have you wiped it from your consciousness like the Turks have wiped the genocide from theirs.

So this is my take on the ruckus. The man is an embarassment to you and your community. He does not serve the needs nor the moral leardership of what the ADL needs to have at that level of responsibility. As long as he is the Fuhrer of your community and eliminates persons of honor with the moral courage to choose to call a genocide a genocide - then the ADL and the Jewish-American will be tarnished.

Teachers drop the Holocaust to avoid offending Muslims
By LAURA CLARK - More by this author » Last updated at 11:58am on 2nd April 2007

Comments Comments (12)
Holocaust

Schools are dropping the Holocaust from history lessons to avoid offending Muslim pupils, a Governmentbacked study has revealed.

It found some teachers are reluctant to cover the atrocity for fear of upsetting students whose beliefs include Holocaust denial.

More....

* Teachers fear backlash over crackdown in the classroom

There is also resistance to tackling the 11th century Crusades - where Christians fought Muslim armies for control of Jerusalem - because lessons often contradict what is taught in local mosques.

The findings have prompted claims that some schools are using history 'as a vehicle for promoting political correctness'.

The study, funded by the Department for Education and Skills, looked into 'emotive and controversial' history teaching in primary and secondary schools.

It found some teachers are dropping courses covering the Holocaust at the earliest opportunity over fears Muslim pupils might express anti-Semitic and anti-Israel reactions in class.

The researchers gave the example of a secondary school in an unnamed northern city, which dropped the Holocaust as a subject for GCSE coursework.

The report said teachers feared confronting 'anti-Semitic sentiment and Holocaust denial among some Muslim pupils'.

It added: "In another department, the Holocaust was taught despite anti-Semitic sentiment among some pupils.

"But the same department deliberately avoided teaching the Crusades at Key Stage 3 (11- to 14-year-olds) because their balanced treatment of the topic would have challenged what was taught in some local mosques."

A third school found itself 'strongly challenged by some Christian parents for their treatment of the Arab-Israeli conflict-and the history of the state of Israel that did not accord with the teachings of their denomination'.

The report concluded: "In particular settings, teachers of history are unwilling to challenge highly contentious or charged versions of history in which pupils are steeped at home, in their community or in a place of worship."

But Chris McGovern, history education adviser to the former Tory government, said: "History is not a vehicle for promoting political correctness. Children must have access to knowledge of these controversial subjects, whether palatable or unpalatable."

The researchers also warned that a lack of subject knowledge among teachers - particularly at primary level - was leading to history being taught in a 'shallow way leading to routine and superficial learning'.

Lessons in difficult topics were too often 'bland, simplistic and unproblematic' and bored pupils.

I don't find Foxman's letter satisfactory at all.   As many have pointed out, he's still essentially lobbying against the resolution.

And this part really gets me:  ". . . and because of our concern for the unity of the Jewish community at a time of increased threats against the Jewish people, ADL has decided to revisit the tragedy that befell the Armenians."  

 This just perpetuates the idea abroard that Jews care for nobody but themselves and hold no higher moral principals than their own self-interest.  It literally makes me sick.

And this:  "On reflection, we have come to share the view of Henry Morgenthau, Sr. that the consequences of those actions were indeed tantamount to genocide."

Notice that he said, "the consequences of those actions", as if those consequences might have been unintended, and he says, "tantamount to genocide", as though it were still not quite genocide.   What?  Genocide light?

Here's what Morgenthau actually said:  "When the Turkish authorities gave the orders for these deportations, they were merely giving the death warrant to a whole race; they understood this well, and, in their conversations with me, they made no particular attempt to conceal the fact."  

There has to be someone better than Foxman to represent the ADL.

Utterly lacking in sincerity, finely tuned to attempt some sort of closure without actually apologizing or giving ground.

To the Armenian from 5:11, I share your understandable offense at Foxman and as a descendant of genocide survivors, I completely sympathize with your feelings toward the Armenian genocide.

That being said, I hope you can find enough openness and understanding in your heart to realize that not all Jews stand with Foxman. Look through this very website and you will find page after page of Jewish posters deploring Foxman's behavior. Although your post avoids any overtly anti-semitic statements, it is nonetheless rude and disrespectful toward an entire people, who you seem to blame for one bad apple (hardly our "absolute leader"!) who many of us are trying to discredit.

As a third-generation American you should know enough about tolerance and respect for other races and ethnicities to avoid such hostility to other ethnic groups. Somehow I have a feeling if you were not anonymous, you would never say what you did.

--Z

When are we, as Armenians, ever going to be able to be given the opportunity to focus our efforts on Armenia instead of international recognition of the Armenian Genocide? Because of people like Foxman, our little country, what is left of the great land that once stretched from the Caspian Sea to the shores of the Black and Mediterranean Seas, suffers greatly the more we focus all our efforts on genocide recognition. Turkey and Azerbaijan maintain blockades against Armenia, and bypass it in economic developments in the region. They wish to wipe out Armenia off the map. But instead of helping us end hostility toward Armenia, Israel and the Jewish lobby are helping Turkey and Azerbaijan perpetuate hostility toward our tiny nation. But we cannot focus efforts on it, when all our efforts combined to obtain recognition for even a simple historical truth are being lobbied against by powerful Jewish lobbies. You, Israel, are supporting Turkey and Azerbeijan's wish to wipe Armenia off the map. When will we be given the chance to democratize our country, get rid of corruption and monopolies? Do you really wish for Armenia to be wiped off the map?

zbird,

The problem is it is not just Foxman. 5:11 is in fact correct in his observations. If you didn't know it, that it is ok, but now is time to wake up and know what is being done in your name.

No one accuses rank and file Jewish Americans of Anti-Armenianism or genocide denial, but the Jewish American organized leadership is certainly guilty and has gone beyond the pale in harming Armenian (and Greek) Americans with its slavish support of Turkey .

Please take a gander at the New Republic exerpt below. First some notes:

1) The Armenian and Greek American communities have been watching the Jewish American lobby unilaterally attack their interests for a decade. This goes beyond issues relating to the nation states of Armenia and Greece, but to matters directly affecting those Americans such as the genocide recognition or the freedom of religion of the Greek Orthodox Patriarchs.

2) there is no evidence of harm in the other direction, ie these lobbies and groups do not attack the interests of the general pro-Israel lobby or the major Jewish groups lobbying in DC.

3) Andrew Tarsy is also a liar, albeit no match for Foxman. He has stated that the ADL has not lobbied Congress on the issue, and only made their position known in response to inquires from the media. That's a big fat lie. Although it was not widely known when the TNR piece blow was written (which also includes denials of lobbying) in fact all congressional offices received a letter from B’nai B’rith International, the Anti-Defamation League, the American Jewish Committee and the Jewish Institute for National Security Affairs "representing" Turkish Jewish concerns -- and both the ADL and JINSA added additional statements their own statements opposing the bill in late April of this year!

4) Ha'aretz and the Jerusalem Post have reported over the past half dozen years on this despicable position by the Jewish American community's leadership in support of everything Turkey's nationalists demand. It is not the stuff of conspiracy or antisemitic websites (and I note you make an assumption of antisemitism on 5:11's part when it is YOU who don't know the facts on which he/she is making their statements.) it is simply not antisemitic to accuse the major Jewish organizations in the states of carrying out a campaign of genocide denial. it is a fact.

5) There are Armenian and Greek Americans who work in Congressional offices. You cannot find antisemitic sentiments among these people. they come from the same demographic and have the same sense of diaspora. They understand the Jewish American community -- THY GET IT. Many see the threats to the homelands to which they have some ethnic affinity. But do you think statements by the ADL that lobbying and strong arming with the Jewish community as the proxy for the worst in Turkish nationalism are not occurring when people are getting the letters and phone calls!?

6) IMHO we are at a crossroads. The Jewish American community's lobbying arms are going to have to decide whether they are going to keep screwing the Armenians and Greeks who are getting more and more pissed off -- and as events in watertown showed -- will not take being baited as antisemites when there is not one wit of evidence.

Foxman et al's position is that any criticism of Israel is now part of the definition of "new antisemitism." The only reasons that the watertown board (and its Greek American member and large Armenian American constituency) are not being branded as antisemites right now are: 1) That members of the Jewish American community realized what their leadership is doing 2) other ethnic groups who care as deeply for their ancestral homelands are not going to be bullied by morally bankrupt hypocrits and are going to scoff at being labeled when in the right.

______

Here is a quote from TNR
"K Street Cashes in on the 1915 Armenian Genocide.
Final Resolution
by Michael Crowley 1 | 2
Post date 07.26.07 | Issue date 07.23.07"

"Earning a special commendation for dubious behavior is Washington's Jewish-American lobby. In one of this tale's strangest twists, the Turks have convinced prominent Jewish groups, not typically indifferent to charges of genocide, to mute their opinions. In February, Turkey's foreign minister convened a meeting at a Washington hotel with more than a dozen leaders of major Jewish groups. Most prominent groups now take no official position on the resolution, including B'nai B'rith, the American Israel Public Affairs Committee (aipac), and the American Jewish Committee. The issue "belongs to historians and not a resolution in Congress," explains Anti-Defamation League director Abe Foxman, who outright opposes the resolution. "It will resolve nothing." But it's also clear that Turkey's status as Israel's lone Muslim ally counts for a lot, too. "I think a lot of Israelis agree," Foxman told me. (One person involved in the fight offers a more cynical explanation: "Jewish groups don't want to give up their ownership of the term genocide.'")

The Turks have also conspicuously hired some lobbyists with strong Jewish ties. Their payroll includes a Washington firm called Southfive Strategies, which bills itself as "a Washington D.C. consulting boutique with access to the White House, congressional leadership, and influential media organizations." Southfive is run by Jason Epstein, a former Capitol Hill lobbyist for B'nai B'rith, and Lenny Ben-David, an Israeli-born former deputy chief of mission at Israel's Washington embassy and a longtime aipac staffer whose previous firm, IsraelConsult, also worked for Turkey."

_______

That is the problem in DC, for ten years, when the Armenian genocide is being denied, it is NOT being done by a Turk, but by Jewish Americans.

Lastly I do applaud Wiesel ( a former professor of mine). He is like my own Greek Jewish grandfather -- a Mensch.

Constantine

To Zbird and others.

Maybe you are right and I might not have said what I said if it was not anonymous. However - the name of "absolute leader" was in reference to the firing (trial without jury) of Andrew Tarsy for stating a different opinion than what is the party line. Reminiscent of the firing of John Evans (ambassador to Armenia) by our "absolute leader" George Bush and company for calling this historical event genocide.

I do apologize for the post being interpreted as rude and disrespectful towards anybody. It was not meant to be. Some may be overtly sensitive to some of the words or questions that were chosen and asked. Maybe the words I chose were wrong or too strong for some pallets. I can state though they were not and the thoughts of my posting were not anti-semitic, just critical and instead they show a preception of dissapointment for a group of people who should be united hand in hand with the Americans of Armenian decent on this issue and are not.

The sad and pathetic truth of the matter is that there are several Jewish organizations lobbying against this resolution. The ADL being one of them. This anti-lobbing may be due to the misguided notion of "protecting Turkish Jews" or "Isreali Strategic Interests" or "questioning whether it was or was not genocide" or "reconcillation between Turks and Armenians". The point of the matter is that it does not matter what the reason for the anti-lobbing effort by this or other Jewish American Orgs - any anit-lobbing is disrespectful to those whose nation has undergone genocide in whatever form it manifests as - and it is a form of DENIAL.

So the American Jewish community has to ask themselves these questions.
Question 1) Do we support the anti-lobbing effort by the ADL and other Jewish American orgs?
There are only two answers to this question - yes or no.
- If no then Jewish American Orgs need to send a clear message to Congress that they support this legislation in full. One way (and probably the most potent way) of sending this message is the firing of your tearless leader - Foxman.
- If yes then it does not matter how many Jews are in the "no - we do not support the anti-lobbing efforts" category - the organizations that represent Jewish American have become hypocritical in nature and determine which side of the fence they are on any particular genocide to suit thier needs.

The truth of the matter is that genocide and the effects of genocide is binary. European Jewish culture and history is gone. Anatolian Armenian (and Assyrian and Greek) culture and history is gone. It can never be replaced or recreated. Your stance on genocide must be binary. You and your leaders can not say we have "revisit the tragety" and "on reflection" it is genocide - with the caveat - we do not support your or our country's recognition of it.

Question 2) Where is the apology from the ADL leadership to the Armenian Americans, Jewish Americans, and all other Americans for taking so long to get off the genocide denial bandwagon? How can this statement by ADL's tearless leader be sincere without an apology?

Finally - there is probably no other American ethnic group other than the Armenian Americans who can truly understand the depth of the pain of the Holocaust in all forms to the Jews and Roma and "others".

Once again - I apologize to anybody who was offended by my last posting. It was not meant to be offensive but critical.

As a Jew who has lost half my family in the Nazi holocaust I completely agree with you. I am shocked and dismayed at Foxman's remarks regarding the Armenian genocide and I have in fact written a letter to the ADL regarding this.

This whole flare up is strange on many levels, with the greatest being the hypocrisy of the ADL. The other element which is being lost unfortunately is the intrasigence of the Turks in not acknowledging their role in perpetuating this genocide. One would think they would want to come clean and admit the terrible wrong they committed. I have seen this on a personal level as I've had Turkish friends who have also denied that any genocide ever occured.

Foxman must be made accountable for his actions.
I don't think this change off heart is enough and more importantly sincere.
Thanks to Foxman Armenians have now a voice in the Jewish community, those who were not aware off the Denial of the Armenian Genocide from these powerful groups now know.
I would like to thank our Jewish friends again for their support on this matter and don't let yourselves be used as a tool for political gain as We Armenians have.
Threatening the lives of Jewish citizens in turkey because America will recognize the Armenian genocide shows the Genocidal nature of those who threaten.
Turkey from time to time has said the Jews are loyal citizens so were the Armenians for 500 years until they were butchered because of their faith.

Let this stop NOW for denying one Genocide allows it to occur again.

Raffi

Did anyone notice the gross distortions in the Ha'aretz article this morning on Foxman's "reversal"?

"In an effort to extricate himself from a scandal surrounding the ADL's refusal to support a bill calling on the Bush administration to recognize the 1915-17 Turkish massacre of its Armenian minority as genocide, . . ."

ADL did more than refuse to support the bill.  It actively lobbied against the bill.

"The ADL was an almost incidental victim of the disappointment and anger felt by the American Armenian community. Most other large Jewish organizations have also refrained from supporting the bill or taking a stance on the Armenian genocide."

An "incidental victim"?  Please!  The ADL actively lobbied against the bill.  What kind of incidental victim is that?

Now I am starting to question the integrity of Ha'aretz as well as the ADL>

Unfortunately Jewish denial of the Armenian Genocide has a long history. Yair Auron has found enough substance on this topic to write two books: The Banality of Indifference (Zionism and the Armenian Genocide) and The Banality of Denial: Israel and the Armenian Genocide (Paperback)

Armenians have known of this for a long long time but it took the combination of factors particularly H.R.106/S.R.106 and Michael Crowley's article in The New Republic to bring this to the attention of the Jewish community at large.

The most significant contributions, initially documenting, exposing and mainstreaming details of the Armenian genocide were made by Jews: Henry Morgenthau Sr., Armin T. Wegner and Franz Werfel.

This has mitigated to a large degree my personal profound disappointment toward the stance taken by many American Jewish groups.

The first rule of getting out of a hole is to stop digging. However, check out this article in the Forward: http://www.forward.com/articles/11470/


It quotes Foxman as saying: "No Armenian lives are under threat today or in danger". I guess he never heard of Hrant Dink.

Foxman has bent, but the old weasel just won't break. He has inched closer to using the G-word in its proper context, but he still had to use qualifiers like "tantamount to" and Clintonisms like "we might have called it genocide if the word genocide had existed at the time" (or whatever his exact words were).

I can see him, like Dr. Strangelove battling with his own right arm, desperately attempting to suppress the forbidden words that demand to burst from his lips: ARMENIAN... (aaaggghhh!)... G E N O C I D E. Whether he'll ever renounce his "neutrality" and stop actively opposing the Congressional resolution to recognize the genocide is another matter. If he falls from power, of course, it won't matter either way.

On to a slightly different issue. For years, Foxman has used the word "anti-Semite" with reckless abandon -- not so much to castigate actual Jew-haters as to intimidate, bully, damage and discredit any gentile who dares to diverge from the party line. Jimmy Carter was his latest victim. What Foxman doesn't seem to get is that nobody loves a bully. We might remain silent for fear of incurring his wrath, but we resent the hell out of him. I wonder how many anti-Semites the man has inadvertently created with his terror tactics. Even I was beginning to resent the Jewish community for labeling all criticism as anti-Semitism -- until I discovered that Foxman was behind most of the name-calling.

The best weapon against anti-Semitism is a free-spirited forum like this one, which reveals that "the Jews" aren't a monolithic and self-righteous power elite (which is the image Foxman & Co. project to the world), but a collection of very individual individuals, most of whom are open-minded, intelligent (no surprise there), and above all, highly decent. As an Armenian-American, I'm touched and more than a bit relieved to renew my affection for the Jews as brothers and sisters who have more in common with us Armenians than perhaps any other group in the world. 

Thank you for expressing your outrage so eloquently, for your solidarity with the Armenian cause, and above all, for having such good and generous hearts.

Rick Bayan

The New Moderate

As Jewish woman I have a huge respect for the Ottoman Empire. My grandfather was born in Jerusalem under the Ottoman Turks and as Israelis know well the Ottomans allowed them freedom of religion unlike every other empire that existed. This set the precedence for a friendship between Israel and Turkey. Obviously one does not befriend its enemy. Jerusalem has had an Armenian quarter for centuries. In all honesty if the Ottomans goal was ethnic cleansing then they would have started in Jerusalem. In fact, under the Ottoman Empire, the Armenians would withhold their taxes as they added onto their churches. Much like when one adds an addition to their home their homes are reassessed. This is what we call “following the law.”

When the public is given the correct information, then we can make an intelligent choice. Our history books give us the proof as the Armenians had a complete alphabet at that time and kept good records as did the Ottomans. However in 2007 is history ignored and replaces with slanting, propaganda and lies.

The House [committee’s] decision to call the Armenian/Turkish conflict [genocide] is ridiculous. It was not racially motivated. There was no ethnic cleansing. If this held any truth then the Armenian quarter could have been wiped out in an hour but instead was respected by the Muslim Ottomans allowing the Armenian quarter to flourish and grow giving them freedom of religion.

Was every massacre throughout history motivated by ethnic cleansing? Certainly not. What Hitler tried to accomplish is a far cry from any Armenian so-called genocide. You cannot deny that many Armenians lost their lives as they were looking for a land of their own, however, what is not recognized is that the Armenians themselves inflicted as much damage as others in the hostilities of that time for their own selfish objectives.

The Turk’s only policy was the removal of Armenians from the front line with Russia, where they were collaborating with the Ottoman Empire’s enemies. They were a threat to security. This is called war.

Regarding persecution, the Ottomans had one of the most tolerant policies towards non-Turks of any empire of its day. The three communities of Jews, Greeks and Armenians were virtually autonomous within the empire. It cannot be denied that throughout history the Ottoman Empire unlike any other empire of its time allowed Jews to practice their own religion as well as many freedoms of their time. When the Ottoman Empire had taken over Jerusalem had they tried to annihilate the strong presence of the Armenians who had their own quarter? Never. Could you say that the Russians committed genocide against the Circassians and Adyghes? If you could then the Armenians slaughtered 200 000 people including Turks and Kurds and Jews in Eastern Anatolia during Turkey’s Independence War while the Turks were fighting against the imperial powers of Europe in 5 fronts. Armenians took the advantage of Turks’ weak position and waged a war against them by opening a new front. But, this was war.

In a recent article in the Jerusalem Post Armenians in Israel led a small protest and were upset that Israel had not taken an official position. One would think that Israel would be the first country to define Genocide with its own history. The problem is that Genocide is being used as a loose term. Israel, a people who have tasted the bitterness of ethnic cleansing would be the first to declare this as a genocide. They have had nearly 90 years to do so. Instead, they have befriended Turkey as the two nations train their military together and have become close allies.

Here in the year 2007 nearly 100 years after the decline of the Ottoman Empire Armenians are still trying wake the dead in this controversy. This is alike to Black African Americans looking for reparations for slavery. And like this it falls upon deaf ears. Society has little tolerance for people with a chip on their shoulder.

It is not enough that this country had not learned from Vietnam and Iraq, but now the House wants to re-write history concerning the Armenian Turkish conflict. The problem is, the West is trying to judge history with respect to its own historical and cultural references. Racism is a Western concept, which didn’t have a place in Turkish or Ottoman history and the West cannot understand anti-racist Ottomans. Annihilation is a Western concept and the West cannot understand the Ottomans which chose to let live instead of wipe out. Assimilation is a Western concept and the West cannot accept the fact that different ethnic groups could live together.

Mainstream Western understanding has given the word “culture” a specific meaning and does not understand culture beyond that. And it chooses to denigrate what it does not understand. The problem is, the last real empire that the West had was the Roman Empire. Later so-called “empires” were only colonial formations, not real empires, and depended on exploitation and repression. Like Ilber Ortayli said, the last Roman type empire was the Ottoman empire.

You can’t really expect the (declining) Western powers to understand and appreciate something that is really different from their understanding of politics. That’s like Americans appreciating Martian culture and politics. However while the House voted, acknowledging the Armenian Genocide, it disregarded the Azerbaijan Genocide of 1905-1907 by the Armenians. War is war. This genocide happened as much as the Jews crucified Jesus.

Renee,

How stupid can you be to use the Armenian Quarters of Jerusalem as the basis for your ignorant argument? The fact is that in Jerusalem the muslims were mostly arabs and not Turks, that makes lots of diference. Muslim arabs in Ottoman Empire always respected Armenians and saw them as equal victims of the Ottoman oppression. And it was the muslim arabs that helped and saved some of the orphans left after Genocide.

I agree with Vrezh's comments above.  Even a scholar of logic would wonder how she could make so many illogical assumptions to reach her conclusions. 

Elie Weisel is not blaming the Turks or even calling it genocide. Read on:
While pontificating on the Armenian Genocide, Elie Wiesel purportedly said,

"No one is asking for the Turks to take responsibility. All the Armenians want is the right to remember. Seven generations separate us from the events that happened in World War I and nobody in his right mind would say that today's Turks are responsible for what happened."—E. Wiesel, as quoted by Harut Sassounian, "Commentary: Wiesel is Right on Genocide Recognition; Wrong on Armenians' Quest for Justice", The California Courier, http://groong.usc.edu/news/msg208776.html (1 November 2007).

Armenians committed acts of genocide a decade earlier against Azerbiejanis and now expect us to say poor you? Not even Elie Weisel will. Read on

Elie Weisel is not blaming the Turks or even calling it genocide. Read on:
While pontificating on the Armenian Genocide, Elie Wiesel purportedly said,

"No one is asking for the Turks to take responsibility. All the Armenians want is the right to remember. Seven generations separate us from the events that happened in World War I and nobody in his right mind would say that today's Turks are responsible for what happened."—E. Wiesel, as quoted by Harut Sassounian, "Commentary: Wiesel is Right on Genocide Recognition; Wrong on Armenians' Quest for Justice", The California Courier, http://groong.usc.edu/news/msg208776.html (1 November 2007).

See what happened was that the Armenians killed all the Azeris, and then they assumed their identities, changed to the Muslim religion, changed their language to Azeri, and they all pretend to be Azeris who hate Armenians.  In fact, they are all secret crypto Armenians.  Even the Azeri who is posting all of the hateful stuff about Armenians here is actually an Armenian pretending to be an Azeri.  That way, nobody will ever suspect the Armenians of killing off all the Azeris.  Pretty smart huh?!